# Woman stabbed 18 times inside German courtroom, husband attacked by police officer



## BCM (Jul 11, 2009)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/07/german-trial-hijab-murder-egypt



> It was while Marwa el-Sherbini was in the dock recalling how the accused had insulted her for wearing the hijab after she asked him to let her son sit on a swing last summer, that the very same man strode across the Dresden courtroom and plunged a knife into her 18 times.
> 
> Her three-year-old son Mustafa was forced to watch as his mother slumped to the courtroom floor.
> 
> Even her husband Elvi Ali Okaz could do nothing as the 28-year-old Russian stock controller who was being sued for insult and abuse took the life of his pregnant wife. As Okaz ran to save her, he too was brought down, shot by a police officer who mistook him for the attacker. He is now in intensive care in a Dresden hospital.


This is really quite sick. You would think that there would be a security check while entering a courtroom. You would think the cop would be able to stop the man from stabbing her 18 times and not be able to react so quickly when her husband tried to stop him.

Any thoughts?


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## Lady Grimdour (Jul 11, 2009)

Well there are people like this in the world. Whether it's racial or religious, there's bound to be someone who's this militant against people who are different from him. The government should've realized that and heightened security.

But calling Germany "the enemies of God" is too much. It was a simple misjudgement which unfortunately caused the death of a woman and sent her husband into intensive care. There's nothing they can do except mourn and campaign against this sort of discrimination. But there's no point in accusing Germany of being anti-Islamic. Granted, the German government needs to remedy this by punishing the murderer and learn from this mistake, but that's it. It's not like Germany's launching an all-out attack against Islam.


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## BCM (Jul 11, 2009)

Misjudgment. I find it hard to believe that a cop can stand there and (apparently) do nothing while a woman gets shot *18* times, and then shoot the husband when he runs over to try to help her. There was no way the cop could have thought that the husband was the attacker.

And it's ridiculous how they didn't have so much as a pat-down (apparently, because if they did, they should have found the knife) or metal detectors for security.

I don't think Germany is islamophobic or anything, but it's ridiculous that a man can bring a knife into a court room, and it's ridiculous that a cop can do nothing about it until someone comes to try to help her. They should already have had some form of security when they first entered the courtroom such as a metal detector or pat-down. The cop was a part of "security". Police are supposed to prevent things like this, not make it worse.


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## Dewgong (Jul 11, 2009)

yeaaah... why did they not have decent security? 18 times is a little much for no reaction. :/


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## Shiny Grimer (Jul 14, 2009)

Islamophobia has been on the rise in Europe. It's sad; if a Muslim attacks a woman for NOT wearing a hijab, the shit will hit the fan. If the opposite happens... not particularly focused on.
I read about this in a Canadian newspaper yesterday and it had everything I wanted to say... but I left it in Canada. :(


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## Zhorken (Jul 14, 2009)

... said:


> I read about this in a Canadian newspaper yesterday and it had everything I wanted to say... but I left it in Canada. :(


Ooh, which newspaper?


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## Shiny Grimer (Jul 14, 2009)

Zhorken said:


> Ooh, which newspaper?


I got it from a hotel in Montreal; it was the Globe or The Mail, and it was written by a woman who I'm pretty sure was Muslim (Shammar Khan something?).


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## Zhorken (Jul 16, 2009)

This would be it, then?  I like it.  I've read a lot of the same things in The Trouble With Islam by Irshad Manji, actually. She focuses (so far as I've read it) more on where mainstream Islam needs to progress; but she also writes the other side, about the kneejerk opinions and reactions to Islam that need to stop.  Also she's a lesbian feminist who doesn't wear any headgear despite following Islam; she talks a lot about how taking religion literally rather than interpreting it for oneself is silly.

EDIT: Also also it seems it's been renamed "The Trouble With Islam Today" since the copy I have was published.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jul 16, 2009)

Zhorken said:


> This would be it, then?  I like it.  I've read a lot of the same things in The Trouble With Islam by Irshad Manji, actually. She focuses (so far as I've read it) more on where mainstream Islam needs to progress; but she also writes the other side, about the kneejerk opinions and reactions to Islam that need to stop.  Also she's a lesbian feminist who doesn't wear any headgear despite following Islam; she talks a lot about how taking religion literally rather than interpreting it for oneself is silly.
> 
> EDIT: Also also it seems it's been renamed "The Trouble With Islam Today" since the copy I have was published.


Yes! Thank you, that's exactly the thing I was talking about.
Also that lady sounds awesome from how you describe her.


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