# Web Designers Club



## Phantom (Jun 18, 2010)

Anyone here know their code? I am talking HTML, Javascript, everything from editing in photoshop, to what I call cheating in Dreamweaver. If you want an example of a site I helped write here


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 18, 2010)

I would consider myself one, except then I'd be lumped together with the people who create ridiculously bad sites like this one.


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## Starshine (Jun 18, 2010)

I'm actually really good in Paint Shop Pro 8, and I have my own site...


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## Max Elixir (Jun 18, 2010)

Charizard2K's site does have its faults, but to describe it as "ridiculously bad" is just abusive. Here are my observations:

Frames are bad. You should probably find another way of doing the front page news.
lists > tables. The table of contents, despite being referred to as a "table", should be comprised entirely of <ul>s.
The sidebars are inconsistent (clicking on some of the links in the "For Students" section results in me being uncerimoniously dumped into the "Research Tools" section with no visible way back).
Visually, it's not a work of art, but that's to be expected from a site whose focus is on practicality rather than entertainment. The colour scheme doesn't cause eye strain, which is nice, but the solid yellow backgrounds mixed with the blue waviness on the logo looks a little schizophrenic.

Anyway, @Starshine: Paint Shop Pro 8?! Wasn't that released in like, 2003? You should probably get something a little more up to date. I personally use GIMP coz it's free.


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 18, 2010)

Max Elixir said:


> Charizard2K's site does have its faults, but to describe it as "ridiculously bad" is just abusive.


_it has an explicit doctype and then goes on to ignore what it just said_; javascript which queries netscape 4.x; images of text; occasional serif-inconsistency. I mean, it's probably bureaucracy, but really, people who think that sort of site is a good thing to claim you helped with deserve a bit of abuse.



> Here are my observations:



Frames are bad. You should probably find another way of doing the front page news.
[/quote]

use divs.



> lists > tables. The table of contents, despite being referred to as a "table", should be comprised entirely of <ul>s.


not quite. tables are for relation of elements. in books, this is title -> location; on a website, the title contains the link.



> The sidebars are inconsistent (clicking on some of the links in the "For Students" section results in me being uncerimoniously dumped into the "Research Tools" section with no visible way back).
> Visually, it's not a work of art, but that's to be expected from a site whose focus is on practicality rather than entertainment. The colour scheme doesn't cause eye strain, which is nice, but the solid yellow backgrounds mixed with the blue waviness on the logo looks a little schizophrenic.


it is also, significantly, a layout that does not look good on any of the frequent resolutions. someone thought having x=800 meant you could use 800 horizontal pixels.



> Anyway, @Starshine: Paint Shop Pro 8?! Wasn't that released in like, 2003? You should probably get something a little more up to date. I personally use GIMP coz it's free.


starshine is probably, like me, one of those people who had the thing on the computer preinstalled and just used it because it worked better than mspaint.


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## Vipera Magnifica (Jun 19, 2010)

Yes. I'm taking an intro course.

Hopefully at one point I can make a site that doesn't fail miserably.


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

sreservoir said:


> _it has an explicit doctype and then goes on to ignore what it just said_; javascript which queries netscape 4.x; images of text; occasional serif-inconsistency. I mean, it's probably bureaucracy, but really, people who think that sort of site is a good thing to claim you helped with deserve a bit of abuse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Look at your post closer.

For someone who insults others coding you can't seem to get basics. There are rules about insulting others sreservoir, please read . Also the school district limits the use of div tags, flash, and even what colors that needed to be used. We use tables because we have numerous students who both they and their parents are legally blind and tables work better for them to read. I helped make it, meaning I wrote what I was told to write that's all; it was a class project. Be nice or don't post at all please, I know I'm not a mod, but I hate trolls and I dislike flaming, and they are against the rules anyways. 

Thank you.


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Yeah Zangviper? What have you gotten to so far?


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

I request we either start over, or I ask that a mod close this thread. Yes I know this is a double post, one time only thing I promise. But I thought this should stand alone.


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 19, 2010)

Charizard2K said:


> Look at your post closer.
> 
> For someone who insults others coding you can't seem to get basics. There are rules about insulting others sreservoir, please read .


_what_ basics? I mean, yes, misplaced quote tag (actually, I think it's just missing initial quote tag), but that's the sort of occasional mistake that happens when you don't check. design mistakes are significantly more annoying than typing mistakes.

as for rules about insulting others; strictly, I commented on the quality of the site, not of a person.



> Also the school district limits the use of div tags, flash, and even what colors that needed to be used.


div tag restriction? seriously? flash and colors, I can understand; flash is a non-standard extension and colors can make things incredibly difficult to read. but divs are a staple of, like, every single modern layout ever. there are iframes on the page.

also:


```
<div align="center">
  <div id="shadow1"> 
    <div id="shadow2"> 
      <div id="container"> 
        <div id="prayer" style="position:absolute; left:335px; top:315px; width:355px; height:125px; z-index:11"><img src="08site/Images/FPtagline2.jpg" width="351" height="110" alt="Prayer Theme " /></div>
        <div id="FlashPics" style="position:absolute; left:70px; top:125px; width:260px; height:260px; z-index:13; visibility: visible;">
```
did you say something about limits on the use of divs? (also, why the style tags on an id'd div? and why does the image need a wrapper div?)



> We use tables because we have numerous students who both they and their parents are legally blind and tables work better for them to read.


better than _lists_? how can a table be harder than a list? and considering it uses iframes, I don't think it's actually made to cater to legally blind people.



> I helped make it, meaning I wrote what I was told to write that's all; it was a class project.


the extended version of this: "type in <html><head><title>foo</title></head><body>hello, world" "look, I made a web page!"

though I'm am a bit curious as to what class you take that the bureaucracy takes your help in designing a school website.



> Be nice or don't post at all please,


be appreciative of people who will actually tell you why you're wrong, even if it doesn't happen until after they insult you. you're not going to meet many of them.



> I know I'm not a mod, but I hate trolls and I dislike flaming, and they are against the rules anyways.


nevertheless, if you post a link to a website you claim without any specific note about it, you should expect it to get picked apart. in this case, an appropriate note would have been something to the effect of "school project; subject to bureaucracy." (hell, since it's not in the advertising forum, I could probably reasonably accuse you of unrequested advertising.)



> Thank you.


and there is really nothing to thank me for, is there?

and just for the record: I am rather hostile to people who think they know what they're doing, and go about it horribly wrong.



Zangviper said:


> Yes. I'm taking an intro course.
> 
> Hopefully at one point I can make a site that doesn't fail miserably.


fun. in web design, I presume?

as for sites that don't fail miserably, the key is to actually have useful content displayed in a usable manner.


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

I volunteered to help. Obviously TCoD has changed a lot while I was gone and they now tolerate flaming, but as sure as hell if I insult you I will get flagged. 

As a person I consider it insulting, it doesn't matter what your intent was. As I am sure you would consider it insulting if you were in my place. 

I didn't make the home page ok? I MADE ONE PAGE out of all the links. One page. Otherwise I just helped design it with what we had. The teacher wrote the main page. Web design was a huge part of my life growing up (I just left college, though my major changed it was originally Computer Sciences) so I wanted to talk about it with others and share ideas, not berate each other.


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 19, 2010)

Charizard2K said:


> I volunteered to help. Obviously TCoD has changed a lot while I was gone and they now tolerate flaming, but as sure as hell if I insult you I will get flagged.


you are now blaming things on a third party. big red flag!



> I didn't make the home page ok?


you _linked_ to the home page. it is not difficult to (here incorrectly) assume that you made the home page.



> I MADE ONE PAGE out of all the links. One page. Otherwise I just helped design it with what we had. The teacher wrote the main page.


I will now mock this statement by taking it to an extreme: "I invented the [blah]." "really? can you then explain why it's inefficient?" "well, I actually only designed part of it. and the box it comes in." "which part?" "the decoration."

there's another problem here, then. the teacher is ignoring the specifications.

and which page did you write?


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

As a person I consider it insulting, it doesn't matter what your intent was. As I am sure you would consider it insulting if you were in my place. 

"though I'm am a bit curious as to what class you take that the bureaucracy takes your help in designing a school website."

Sure sounds insulting to me. And WTF 'bureaucracy'? Its called I went to an inter city school and the school was shit poor if that's what you mean by that. 

I posted it as a conversation starter, why in hell would I _advertise_ a high school? 

"and just for the record: I am rather hostile to people who think they know what they're doing, and go about it horribly wrong."

So you admit to being hostile? Weren't two seconds ago you saying it wasn't personal?

Why are you personally attacking me?


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 19, 2010)

Charizard2K said:


> I volunteered to help. Obviously TCoD has changed a lot while I was gone and they now tolerate flaming, but as sure as hell if I insult you I will get flagged.
> 
> As a person I consider it insulting, it doesn't matter what your intent was. As I am sure you would consider it insulting if you were in my place.
> 
> I didn't make the home page ok? I MADE ONE PAGE out of all the links. One page. Otherwise I just helped design it with what we had. The teacher wrote the main page. Web design was a huge part of my life growing up (I just left college, though my major changed it was originally Computer Sciences) so I wanted to talk about it with others and share ideas, not berate each other.


dup of above.



> "though I'm am a bit curious as to what class you take that the bureaucracy takes your help in designing a school website."
> 
> Sure sounds insulting to me. And WTF 'bureaucracy'? Its called I went to an inter city school and the school was shit poor if that's what you mean by that.


exactly what it says on the tin: 





			
				Wikipedia said:
			
		

> Bureaucracy is the combined organizational structure, procedures, protocols, and set of regulations in place to manage  activity, usually in large organizations. As opposed to adhocracy, it is often represented by standardized procedure (rule-following) that guides the execution of most or all processes within the body; formal division of powers; hierarchy; and relationships, intended to anticipate needs and improve efficiency.





> I posted it as a conversation starter, why in hell would I _advertise_ a high school?


you wouldn't say you would. would you call something you didn't actually do an example of your work? you'd probably say you wouldn't.



> "and just for the record: I am rather hostile to people who think they know what they're doing, and go about it horribly wrong."
> 
> So you admit to being hostile? Weren't two seconds ago you saying it wasn't personal?


yes, I admit to being hostile. I will continue to say it isn't personal. hostility isn't personal.


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

sreservoir said:


> yes, I admit to being hostile. I will continue to say it isn't personal. hostility isn't personal.


hos·til·i·ty   /hɒˈstɪlɪti/  Show Spelled[ho-stil-i-tee]   
–noun, plural -ties.  
1. a hostile state, condition, or attitude; enmity; antagonism; unfriendliness. 
2. a hostile act. 
3. opposition or resistance to an idea, plan, project, etc. 
4. hostilities, 
a. acts of warfare. 
b. war. 

—Related forms 
non·hos·til·i·ty, noun 
o·ver·hos·til·i·ty, noun 
pre·hos·til·i·ty, noun, plural -ties. 
sem·i·hos·til·i·ty, noun 

—Synonyms 
1.  animosity, animus, ill will, hatred. 4.  fighting, conflict. 
—Antonyms 
1.  friendliness. 4.  peace. 

Sounds like it could definately be personal.


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 19, 2010)

Charizard2K said:


> could


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## Phantom (Jun 19, 2010)

> Rule #4: Don't flame.
> Do not make hurtful comments about other members' opinions, beliefs, religion, nationality, sexual orientation, skin color, etc. This includes general hurtful or degrading comments about groups of people which other members may or may not belong to. Of course you are allowed to disagree with a person's opinions, but please do so in a respectful manner. State your disagreement by all means, but if you think somebody is the dumbest person you've ever met and deserves to rot in Hell, just keep it to yourself. Any blatant insult will give you a nasty 30-point infraction (disabling your Serious Business access and getting you banned if you flame again before the warning expires) which won't go away for three months.
> 
> You can also get warned for flaming if you excessively bash a Pokémon, character, movie, TV show, book, band, etc. at a level where fans of said Pokémon/character/movie/TV show/book/band/etc. can feel insulted about it too. So please no "I hate (insert Pokémon here), it's completely useless and only n00bs use it."


Taken from the Forum Rules


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## 1. Luftballon (Jun 19, 2010)

since we are now arguing the definitions of words and the text of rules, reread sent. 3, and sent. 4 clause 1.


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## Tailsy (Jun 19, 2010)

Closing this thread as per request.


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