# The Gay (Marriage) Thread



## Shiny Grimer (Dec 31, 2009)

Every couple of months, there's a thread concerning gay marriage or gay civil rights. "Gay marriage is legal in X State!" "Shiiiit, civil unions were outlawed in Y Country!" It'd be kind of cool to have a single thread to discuss all these things in context. I hereby dub this The Gay (Marriage) Thread.

*AWESOME NEWS*: Mexico City legalized gay marriage and gay adoptions! yessss Latin America is ridiculously conservative (it makes the US look like Sweden, though it's not as conservative as Africa + Middle East), so this is good news! The country is very Catholic, so expect opposition, but that this got approved in the first place rules.
Uruguay legalizes civil unions. Not gay marriage, but civil unions. Still a start!
Argentina allows civil unions and has first gay marriage.

*SUCKISH NEWS*: 
Ugandan lawmakers consider passing anti-gay bill. This is more than an anti-gay law. This law makes being gay _illegal_, as in you get the death penalty if you are found guilty of, you know, being gay. Family members, friends, and even landlords that fail to report someone's homosexuality face prison. fuck fuck fuck

*AMBIGUOUS NEWS*: Rwanda to scrap anti-gay part of bill. The UNAIDS council requested that a part of the bill which focused on homosexuals (probably ones with AIDS) be removed since it goes against the international charter of human rights. OK, so this won't be in the penal code. However, there is still insistence that homosexuality should not ever be considered normal, and most Rwandans are apparently disgusted by this.

Discuss, yo.


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## departuresong (Dec 31, 2009)

Hopefully the civilized world will legalize gay marriage universally within the next couple of decades. I have no hope for the red/orange/brown countries here, though.

(In regards to that map above, wouldn't being gay in South Africa be really difficult? Like, if you want to go north at all, it suddenly becomes a crime.)


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Dec 31, 2009)

Africa depresses me but I am glad to see the world turning progressively more blue. Look at that little Latin America c: just got to reach a darker shade, loves.

Yeah, I very much hope the situation will change over the next few years. It's likely, since marriage was first legalized in 2001 in Holland and has spread pretty well in a little under ten years. We'll have to see how the next decade goes, but I'm optimistic.
The US kind of looks like a jigsaw puzzle with a bunch of missing pieces :v if they ever make a straight line across the country (though you'd probably have to get Utah in there so not fucking likely) it'd be pretty cool. The Gay Line.


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## opaltiger (Dec 31, 2009)

> yessss Latin America is ridiculously conservative (it makes the US look like Sweden, though it's not as conservative as Africa + Middle East), so this is good news!


hahahaha what

point out to me the last time the USA had a nationwide anti-homophobia campaign run by the government


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## Shiny Grimer (Dec 31, 2009)

> point out to me the last time the USA had a nationwide anti-homophobia campaign run by the government


In terms of overall social policy, yes, the USA is more liberal than Latin America (I said that Latin America made the USA _look_ like Sweden; it's still depressingly conservative on social issues). In any case, I'd reckon that being gay in the United States is far easier than being gay in Latin America, even with these gay marriage laws. There's a lot more sexism there, too, and definitely prejudice against non-white people. Overall, the USA is more liberal (tolerant?) on these issues compared to most Latin American countries.

I _wish_ it were actually like Sweden.


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## opaltiger (Dec 31, 2009)

You missed my point. The nationwide anti-homophobia campaign I was referencing was run by the _Brazilian_ government.


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## Firelord Alex (Dec 31, 2009)

I can't believe it is even possible to outlaw a sexuality.  That is like making it a crime to be anorexic.


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## departuresong (Dec 31, 2009)

I wouldn't go comparing anorexia to homosexuality, but okay.


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## opaltiger (Dec 31, 2009)

Oh, whoops. I thought you said South America at the beginning. Yeah, Central America is pretty homophobic overall - though there's always Mexico!

The majority of the South American countries, though - Brazil, Uruguay, and Argentina are the leading examples - are _much_ more progressive than the US when it comes to issues of gay rights.


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## Teh Ebil Snorlax (Jan 1, 2010)

The Civil Marriage Bill is supposed to becoming through here in Ireland later this year. Civil unions. Blech. It's better than nothing but still.


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## departuresong (Jan 1, 2010)

Civil unions are an insult.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 1, 2010)

I get that (separate but equal), but it's still a victory, no? Hopefully, over time, as civil unions become more widespread, people will realize "Hey, these gay people in a relationship aren't so bad. We're doing something wrong by relegating them to this 'other' union" and start to fight for gay marriage or something that puts their relationship in the same context as a straight marriage.


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## departuresong (Jan 1, 2010)

I don't know. I see them as so massively degrading that I'd much rather not have them at all. At least in the US, those in a civil union are still missing about 1,000 rights that married couples have, so you can't really say it's "separate but equal." Just "separate."


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## opaltiger (Jan 1, 2010)

The Irish do have the best ad ever, though.


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## Zuu (Jan 1, 2010)

I love how Canada is just that huge dark blue wonderful spot that makes the US look pathetic.


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## departuresong (Jan 1, 2010)

I love Canada. She's our progressive and rebellious little sister.

...Too bad she's so uninteresting.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 2, 2010)

I wouldn't call Canada 'rebellious'~
Just boring.
The most interesting thing that's happened in Canadian politics, according to the Canadians at Starmen, is the coalition thing. yay?


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## Dinru (Jan 2, 2010)

The 'tvs and trees coexisting' tag made me laugh.

Canada rocks, Mexico City is <3

Also, just 'cause Canada isn't on the news all the time doesn't mean it's boring :< It just means it's safer. Which some might say is boring, but most wouldn't.


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## J.T. (Jan 2, 2010)

Well I mean I live in Canada and even I think it's boring compared to everything else that goes on in the world :<

not that that's necessarily bad! It's better than having something huge shake up the whole country. Or our government going batshit and massively violating human rights a la Uganda.

Also that tag is brilliant.


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## Harlequin (Jan 2, 2010)

We've had civil unions since 2002, and I think it's time to get rid of them. Fuck them.

Vive le mariage!


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 2, 2010)

The Portuguese Conservatives (PSD) are proposing a civil union bill.
Knowing Portuguese politics I'm pretty sure this will prompt the Socialists to pass a marriage bill with the support of the Communists and Left Block. Fingers crossed :v


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## Tarvos (Jan 2, 2010)

Well Europe is gonna get there first anyway. I suppose Denmark will get there soon too. Or hopefully France/Germany.


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## opaltiger (Jan 2, 2010)

At this rate Slovenia will sign its bill by March ok give us some credit


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## Tarvos (Jan 2, 2010)

Well, you're not the first, but yes, good work Slovenia.

Although you're still behind the Netherlands, you're in the top 10 countries of WHO GOT THERE FIRST WITH LEGALISED GAY MARRIAGE


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## departuresong (Jan 2, 2010)

How many gay people are in Slovenia?

*noticed that Slovenia's population is half of his state's*


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## Tarvos (Jan 2, 2010)

I suppose the same average as everywhere else, between 1-10%?


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## opaltiger (Jan 2, 2010)

we have one of the most organised movements in Europe. First LGBT film festival in Europe, among other things.


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## Tarvos (Jan 2, 2010)

hey thats cool

i'm just straight

_just so you know_


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 3, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> The Portuguese Conservatives (PSD) are proposing a civil union bill.





Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> Conservatives are proposing a civil union bill.





Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> *Conservatives*


What is this magical land where conservatives propose civil unions?

The USA can't even have Democrats proposing a civil union bill without everyone getting all pissy, but in Portugal the _conservatives_ are proposing a civil union bill?

I'm sorry, my mind is like blown. Umm, I guess this goes under _awesome news_.

*AWESOME NEWS:* Slovenia new Family Code ready to go to Parliament. Possibly ready by March. _go slovenia go_

Portugal to probably legalize gay marriage in 2010. Socialists and other center-of-left parties will probably approve it.

Not really news (October '09) but 62% of French people support gay marriage.

Kind of old but has a relevant clause: Nepal okays same-sex marriage and will possibly have a bill about it ready by 2010. Let's see if Nepal keeps its promises! The supreme Court decision in the article also said that all LGBT people were natural persons and had full rights and shiz. So nice to know that Nepal thinks that.

Washington, D.C. says same sex *marriage* is okay and according to an unsourced Wiki comment, could begin as early as February, 2010. Yay, D.C.~.

And I think this is kind of cute: New Hampshire same-sex marriage law takes effect after Midnight, New Year's Day. What a nice way to start the new year, New Hampshire! Wow, I actually have some hope for my country.


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## opaltiger (Jan 3, 2010)

> I'm sorry, my mind is like blown. Umm, I guess this goes under awesome news.


Iceland passed its civil union law unanimously.

In _1996._


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## spaekle (Jan 3, 2010)

Does anyone know anything about prop 8 going to the federal supreme court? I know people have been trying to get it there, and I think I read it mentioned in passing in some article that it'd be going there this year, but I can't find anything else that confirms it.


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## nastypass (Jan 3, 2010)

opaltiger said:


> Iceland passed its civil union law unanimously.
> 
> In _1996._


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## opaltiger (Jan 3, 2010)

Yeah, the lawyers who argued Bush v. Gore are trying to get it to SCOTUS. Which will likely take years and is a bit of a terrible idea; there simply isn't enough support on the Supreme Court to overturn it.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 3, 2010)

... said:


> What is this magical land where conservatives propose civil unions?
> 
> The USA can't even have Democrats proposing a civil union bill without everyone getting all pissy, but in Portugal the _conservatives_ are proposing a civil union bill?
> 
> I'm sorry, my mind is like blown. Umm, I guess this goes under _awesome news_.


Haha, it IS cool, even though it's probably an attempt to piss of the Socialists because politicians are kids. The only parties that are really against it in Portugal are the parties right of the PSD and half or so of the PSD members. The Socialists just let everyone down by not voting for the gay marriage law (except for Manuel Alegre but he's awesome) but they said they'd do it this year and while I don't have high hopes I guess they'll do it now that even the Conservatives are pressuring them :v

In Kool Newz the leader of the Russian Orthodox church (Patriarch Kirill/Cyrill) said gays shouldn't be persecuted at all. Mindfuck ensued.
I'm sort of hoping this means this year's Moscow Pride will be mostly free of religious extremists and Nazis but it's not gonna happen. The Mayor of Moscow is a lvl.10 homophobe on top of everything so uh


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 3, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> The Socialists just let everyone down by not voting for the gay marriage law


what :( socialist fail



> but they said they'd do it this year and while I don't have high hopes I guess they'll do it now that even the Conservatives are pressuring them :v


I hope they'll do it this year. Quick, Europe! Go put the US to shame!



> In Kool Newz the leader of the Russian Orthodox church (Patriarch Kirill/Cyrill) said gays shouldn't be persecuted at all. Mindfuck ensued.
> I'm sort of hoping this means this year's Moscow Pride will be mostly free of religious extremists and Nazis but it's not gonna happen. The Mayor of Moscow is a lvl.10 homophobe on top of everything so uh


Wow, that's interesting. The amount of homophobia in Russia makes me sad, but hey, maybe that will change in the future? ...


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## Mango (Jan 4, 2010)

This thread is really gay.


lolcwutididthar


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## Tarvos (Jan 4, 2010)

So are you.


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## Dannichu (Jan 4, 2010)

Okay, so I have a question for someone more knowledgable about UK politics than me (who will embarassingly almost certainly be someone from outside the UK); with the UK election coming up and such, all the news keeps talking about David Cameron wanting to give married couples tax benefits and such. I'm gonna guess no, but thought I'd ask: assuming this came to pass (which at the moment it may or may not), would it also apply to couples within a civil union?

(the fact I even have to ask this question is evidence for the "civil unions are rubbish" argument)


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 4, 2010)

Dannichu said:


> all the news keeps talking about David Cameron wanting to give married couples tax benefits and such. Would it also apply to couples within a civil union?



http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/dec/09120111.html



> The leader of Britain's Conservative party said yesterday that under a Tory government, same-sex partners in registered domestic partnerships would be afforded the same tax benefits as married couples.


Not sure how unbiased this site is. This quote is a little creepy:



> In May this year, the Conservative party indicated that support for the *homosexualist political agenda *would be among the top five priorities for the party.


Homosexualist political agenda? Seriously?


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## spaekle (Jan 4, 2010)

I didn't even know 'homosexualist' was a word.


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## Dannichu (Jan 5, 2010)

Thank you! Oh, that's pretty cool (well, issues with marriage as a concept aside, it's nice to see the Tory party acknowledging gay couples on the same level as straight ones); the word (especially the context in which it is used) "homsexualist" is hilarious, though; regarding gay and straight couples being seen as equal as anything-"ist" is pretty funny, and the article describing PinkNews as a "homosexualist news service" is almost hysterical XD


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 6, 2010)

I think they're going to interview either David Cameron or one of his trolls in Attitude (gay mag) sometime soon, since they did Gordie last month. I could scan it in if anyone wants.

Also who's surprised. Jesus.


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## goldenquagsire (Jan 6, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> I think they're going to interview either David Cameron or one of his trolls in Attitude (gay mag) sometime soon, since they did Gordie last month. I could scan it in if anyone wants.


Go fer it. :D



> Also who's surprised. Jesus.


I heard about that a while ago. Pretty shitty stuff. :(

also ffs



> “That’s horrible, absolutely horrible,” he said. “Some of the nicest people I have ever met are gay people.”


When will people realise that this is a shitty cliched line. Even used innocently, it sounds pretty slimy; coming from someone as openly anti-gay as Don Schmierer, it's just fucking tasteless.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 6, 2010)

goldenquagsire said:


> When will people realise that this is a shitty cliched line. Even used innocently, it sounds pretty slimy; coming from someone as openly anti-gay as Don Schmierer, it's just fucking tasteless.


Some of my best friends are black!...


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## opaltiger (Jan 6, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> Some of my best friends are black!...


I let them use my bathroom!


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## Ether's Bane (Jan 7, 2010)

ShiningGlass said:


> Hopefully the civilized world will legalize gay marriage universally within the next couple of decades. I have no hope for the red/orange/brown countries here, though.
> 
> (In regards to that map above, wouldn't being gay in South Africa be really difficult? Like, if you want to go north at all, it suddenly becomes a crime.)


This further proves that I live in a crappy country.

Also, yay for Slovenia!


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## departuresong (Jan 7, 2010)

Well, damn.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 8, 2010)

ShiningGlass said:


> Well, damn.


Arrrghhhh

I BEAR GOOD AND BAD NEWS
Good news: marriage passed parliament in Portugal! The President just has to ratify it now (even though he's centre-right)! And it'd come into effect one month before the Pope comes to visit YEAAAH
Bad news: adoption got refused :c well dang. We'll come round, don't worry. 

We'll place sixth in the European Gay Marriage Countdown. At last, not in the final three! :v


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## Jolty (Jan 8, 2010)

ShiningGlass said:


> Well, damn.


I've just been having a mega rant about this on the other forum I go to lol

I also said I'd do whatever the hell it takes to get rid of civil unions over here. MARRIAGE FOR ALLLLLL


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## Tarvos (Jan 8, 2010)

why don't people focus on employment issues, environment, etc over gay issues

i know homophobia is stupid and all and i agree but it's such a non-issue to me


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## departuresong (Jan 8, 2010)

It _should_ be a non-issue.


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## Minish (Jan 8, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> I think they're going to interview either David Cameron or one of his trolls in Attitude (gay mag) sometime soon, since they did Gordie last month. I could scan it in if anyone wants.
> 
> Also who's surprised. Jesus.





> Uganda’s minister of ethics and integrity (who previously tried to ban miniskirts) recently said, “Homosexuals can forget about human rights.”


Urgh, that's just horrendous. >_>



Watershed said:


> why don't people focus on employment issues, environment, etc over gay issues
> 
> i know homophobia is stupid and all and i agree but it's such a non-issue to me


It's hardly a 'non-issue' when an article's just been posted about a country posing _the death penalty_ for homosexuality. :/

Surely the fact that we want equal rights is enough for it to be an issue? Homophobia affects an awful lot of people on a daily basis -- it might be a non-issue for _you_, but I'm pretty sure we can all tell why that might be.

Plus, it's human nature to be more interested and involved in something that directly affects you.


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## departuresong (Jan 8, 2010)

I think Altmer's implying that those who spend so much time fighting something as trivial as gay marriage should put their money and energy into fighting for something else.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 8, 2010)

Watershed said:


> why don't people focus on employment issues, environment, etc over gay issues
> 
> i know homophobia is stupid and all and i agree but it's such a non-issue to me


In this thread in particular because it's th'gay thread
in the rest of the world I guess people like to blow up ultimately insignificant stuff to monstrous porportions?


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## Minish (Jan 8, 2010)

ShiningGlass said:


> I think Altmer's implying that those who spend so much time fighting something as trivial as gay marriage should put their money and energy into fighting for something else.


But for some people, being able to marry isn't all that trivial. It shouldn't just be abandoned because energy could be spent elsewhere.


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## departuresong (Jan 8, 2010)

You're misreading what I wrote. I said those who _oppose_ it should put their energy into something else.


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## Minish (Jan 8, 2010)

He said that homophobia is stupid and all, _but_ a non-issue. Not same-sex marriages.


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## departuresong (Jan 8, 2010)

Then I guess I misread his post.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 10, 2010)

Ok, here are some things! Not exactly gay related, but still LGBT.

*AWESOME NEWS:* Amanda Simpson was appointed as head of the Department of Commerce. She is the second transgender political appointee in any administration. I don't know much about her, but that a transgender can be judged on the worth of their talents rather than what set of genitals they were born in is great.

*SUCKISH NEWS:* David Letterman, American talk show host, made a very insensitive and unfunny joke about Amanda Simpson. Thanks, not. 40% of Huffington Post readers seem to think that it was funny. Asshole move.

*OK NEWS:* Reports out of Kampala Wednesday indicated that the death penalty may be dropped from the final version of the Uganda bill. There's still all the other crap (and apparently, if Ugandans have sex with someone of the same sex outside of Uganda, they are to be extradited to Uganda. this is a punishment reserved for _terrorists_). I wish the US were cool and that Obama would be all like "We'll protect the gay Ugandans!", but that's too much to ask, apparently. :(


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## Automata heart (Jan 10, 2010)

i beleve that if someone loves someone else, they should be allowed to mary that person.
also, i have  NEVER met a mean gay person.


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## Tarvos (Jan 11, 2010)

ShiningGlass said:


> It _should_ be a non-issue.


I know right.



Cirrus said:


> It's hardly a 'non-issue' when an article's just been posted about a country posing _the death penalty_ for homosexuality. :/
> 
> Surely the fact that we want equal rights is enough for it to be an issue? Homophobia affects an awful lot of people on a daily basis -- it might be a non-issue for _you_, but I'm pretty sure we can all tell why that might be.
> 
> Plus, it's human nature to be more interested and involved in something that directly affects you.


People impose the death penalty for stealing. Humans aren't just misguided towards homosexuals. Remember the sharia? Fuck you, muslim countries. Then again all religious law should be abolished per direct and replaced with secular law. Separation of church and state. Fast.




ShiningGlass said:


> I think Altmer's implying that those who spend so much time fighting something as trivial as gay marriage should put their money and energy into fighting for something else.


Exactly. Their opposition is stupid because you know, you could STOP PEOPLE FROM DYING OF FAMINE INSTEAD OF CARING ABOUT PENIS GOES UP ASS





Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> In this thread in particular because it's th'gay thread
> in the rest of the world I guess people like to blow up ultimately insignificant stuff to monstrous porportions?


aye



Cirrus said:


> But for some people, being able to marry isn't all that trivial. It shouldn't just be abandoned because energy could be spent elsewhere.


_Marriage is a fucking paper_

real marriage is the ceremony, just merge civil unions and marriages and give them all equal rights, and let everyone that wants a ceremony have a ceremony

problem fucking solved



ShiningGlass said:


> You're misreading what I wrote. I said those who _oppose_ it should put their energy into something else.





Cirrus said:


> He said that homophobia is stupid and all, _but_ a non-issue. Not same-sex marriages.


it is bad but i can think of worse things

like people dying of famine, global warming, etc.

eta: in a really good country, state officials perform all civil unions/marriages regardless of their personal beliefs. They should be required to do this by law and every country should be officially void of religion.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 11, 2010)

I basically have the same opinion as you do, Altmer, but I think it's because we both live in pretty progressive countries where gays aren't really anything special. Of course if there was a choice between, I don't know, every country becoming secular or every country having gay marriage I'd go for the former, but you can't expect every country to do the right thing immediately, surely? It's a long way until most muslim countries get human rights.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 12, 2010)

Watershed said:


> it is bad but i can think of worse things
> 
> like people dying of famine, global warming, etc.


why are you caring about how gay people are being treated when we have _serious problems_ to solve?

This is the same argument that's been used against people that work for civil rights (so the death penalty is inhumane and cruel? who cares! there's a genocide in Darfur!) of all kinds. You know, why care about racism/sexism/ablism/etc. when we have _worse_ issues to focus on? I understand prioritizing things but I think gay people being treated inhumanely across the globe is a pretty bad issue.

This thread is the marriage thread because it's easy to track marriage. You can't make a post saying "In Switzerland, I have determined that people now make less demeaning comments about gays!" Marriage is the obvious sign of "victory", so to speak, but this is also the "gay" thread, about the treatment of LGBT people in general.

I agree with you on the whole secular/religious law and the thing about marriage ceremonies. Especially the marriage ceremonies. If only people could see it differently...

Anyway...

*AMBIGUOUS NEWS:* The first US federal court case to determine whether states are allowed to ban same-sex marriages has opened in San Francisco, California. This is ambiguous because it could turn out to be like 'Brown v. Board of Education' or it could end up bein 'Plessy v. Ferguson' and I have a bad feeling it's going to end up like the latter.


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## Autumn (Jan 12, 2010)

... said:


> *AMBIGUOUS NEWS:* The first US federal court case to determine whether states are allowed to ban same-sex marriages has opened in San Francisco, California. This is ambiguous because it could turn out to be like 'Brown v. Board of Education' or it could end up bein 'Plessy v. Ferguson' and I have a bad feeling it's going to end up like the latter.


That would mean completely disregarding the Full Faith and Credit clause :(


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## opaltiger (Jan 12, 2010)

Leafpool said:


> That would mean completely disregarding the Full Faith and Credit clause :(


DOMA does that already.


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## Autumn (Jan 12, 2010)

opaltiger said:


> DOMA does that already.


... you're right, it does. Dammit.


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## Tarvos (Jan 12, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> I basically have the same opinion as you do, Altmer, but I think it's because we both live in pretty progressive countries where gays aren't really anything special. Of course if there was a choice between, I don't know, every country becoming secular or every country having gay marriage I'd go for the former, but you can't expect every country to do the right thing immediately, surely? It's a long way until most muslim countries get human rights.


Failure is not an option


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## spaekle (Jan 12, 2010)

Well it certainly seems the No on 8 side is presenting the stronger case. Don't know just how much that says about anything, but it makes me feel a bit better. I'm not sure about this.

Also, lol, did they _seriously_ show the gathering storm video? Hahahahahaha.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 13, 2010)

Watershed said:


> Failure is not an option


I agree. However, I think it's alright for gay marriage to have its own thread instead of people posting a news topic every other week. That way the faggotry is contained.
I would love to see more human rights progress in the middle east/eastern europe (and I hope to be able to visit some countries and maybe help out if I ever get my political science degree) but it's a depressingly slow process so it's hard to talk about it, whereas everyone's kicking gays into top speed because it's the Current Concern I guess. We could make a thread for other important issues if you'd like.


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 13, 2010)

Vladimir Putin's LJ said:


> We could make a thread for other important issues if you'd like.


I wanted to do this! It even had a snappy title: "Current Events". It would be like a place where we post news to _get informed_ or discuss shiz. And interested parties could post their own news, too, so we could have _worldwide news_. If anyone wants me to make it, I'd be glad~

And yeah, this was made because every two months we get a thread about LGBT people and I thought it'd be better if we stuck it all in one place. At least then, it's easier to follow the progress.



> I would love to see more human rights progress in the middle east/eastern europe (and I hope to be able to visit some countries and maybe help out if I ever get my political science degree) but it's a depressingly slow process so it's hard to talk about it


A teacher of mine is doing this. He's leaving our class for like, a year to go help with some development project in India, IIRC.


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## Tarvos (Jan 13, 2010)

i think czech republic is improving a lot with regards to gay rights iirc


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## Shiny Grimer (Jan 13, 2010)

Watershed said:


> i think czech republic is improving a lot with regards to gay rights iirc


Go, Czech Republic! Polka your way to a brighter tomorrow or something.

*COOL NEWS:* Because of the shitstorm caused by the idea of executing gay people and because a whole bunch of other countries are bothered by this, President of Uganda is distancing himself from the anti-gay bill. Maybe there's hope for Uganda's gay population... somehow, someway.

I'm starting to have hope for 2010. Perhaps there _is_ a way to convince people that it's ok to let other people like it up the ass _and_ be married at the same time.


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## Tarvos (Jan 14, 2010)

I heard there was a gay marriage ceremony in China. Or at least, I read it in the newspaper. It wasn't official or anything, though.


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## EvilCrazyMonkey (Jan 19, 2010)

I see how it can be important to decide what is important and gets priority, but, ugh, don't we also have to focus on people being treated equally (like, well, they should be). It is pretty perspicuous that gays deserve the same rights as others. And in the case of equal civil unions, well, separate is never equal. I don't see why some "less important" issues should be completely forgotten.


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## Tarvos (Jan 19, 2010)

They shouldn't be forgotten if you live in Uganda. But they are not that important when you live in Spain, France or Germany because all it would take is a proper proposal to get marriage through in about 3 seconds (except spain. they obvi have it already, which is quite an achievement considering spain is pretty catholic)

And in my country we already have it, so err, we might as well do something useful now.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Jan 19, 2010)

Yeah in Portugal we'll get it soonish too, so I can get married to whoever I want in all of my home countries! :v hooray
Well, the President still has to sign the bill, and there's some worry that he'll say he can't sign it because it's discriminatory (since adoption hasn't passed). People say the Socialists are awaiting this and will use the opportunity to pass adoption at the same time but I don't buy it since they were the ones who rejected the law in the first place so uh
Either if it passes it'll be fun when the Pope comes to visit in April.

I think Spain and Portugal have people with pretty similar mindsets. We're Catholic, but not Polish-Catholic, just keeping-up-appearances-Catholic :v everyone in my village is like that. They'll go to church and praise god and go on trips to shrines and the whole rigmarole but secretly they just want some company, especially the old ladies.

And yeah it'd be cool if Merkel just passed the marriage law already so Holland-Belgium-Netherlands can become the Gay Trifecta we are meant to be. France can join in once Sarkozy loses the election.


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## Tarvos (Jan 19, 2010)

my parents are catholic

as in someone sprinkled them with water


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## Harlequin (Jan 20, 2010)

For like most non-gays it's nothing to actually worry about, but it *is* a big issue to, er, gays. Screw the economy, I want a big gay wedding. >:( (also big gay weddings would HELP the economy since gays have lots of disposable income)


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## Teh Ebil Snorlax (Jan 21, 2010)

It baffles the mind that people still oppose marriage equality when it's socially, economically and morally beneficial to mankind.


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## Dannichu (Jan 21, 2010)

Harlequin said:


> For like most non-gays it's nothing to actually worry about, but it *is* a big issue to, er, gays. Screw the economy, I want a big gay wedding. >:( (also big gay weddings would HELP the economy since gays have lots of disposable income)


Have you been listening to Neil Patrick Harris?

(why yes, I will look for any excuse to post that vid)


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## Doctor Jimmy (Jan 21, 2010)

I'm happy to live in a good state.


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## Vladimir Putin's LJ (Feb 13, 2010)

Alright, I said I'd post the interviews with different British party leaders, and I finally got round to it. The pictures they took of Brown head-on are kind of, er, word. Italics is for pages that are just photos:

*Gordon Brown*:
_1_ 2 _3_ 4 5

*Nick Clegg*:
1 _2_ _3_ 4 5

*David Cameron*:
1 _2_ _3_ 4 5 6 _7_ 8


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