# Watchmen



## Butterfree (Mar 9, 2009)

Seen the movie, read the comic, anything? Thoughts?

I saw the movie on Friday and am currently exactly halfway through the comic, and I sense an obsession coming on, so I had to make a thread. :D


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## Lady Grimdour (Mar 9, 2009)

Oh yesssss.

Rorschach is awesome beyond words.


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## opaltiger (Mar 9, 2009)

Read three chapters so far. I am somehow not as impressed as all the hype has made me feel I should be.


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## Erif (Mar 9, 2009)

I want to see this SOOOOOO badly.

Oh my fucking god.


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## Taliax (Mar 9, 2009)

I won't see it because it has nudity and it's rated R.


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## Dragon of Fire (Mar 9, 2009)

I didn't see the movie yet and I never read the comics. I want to see the movie pretty badly, it seems really cool.


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## Erif (Mar 10, 2009)

Taliax said:


> I won't see it because it has nudity and it's rated R.


Lol, you don't see me cryin like a little bitch.

Jk.


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## Butterfree (Mar 10, 2009)

So! I have just finished the final chapter of the graphic novel. :o Time to randomly compare the book and the movie because I feel like it!



Spoiler: Watchmen book and film



Overall, I thought the film treated it reasonably well. The comic had a lot more background depth and explained interesting details that I'd been wondering about (e.g. how Rorschach made/obtained that ever-changing mask of his), but most of the things that were changed or left out were not particularly significant. Granted, I would probably miss a lot of it if I had read the comic _first_, but the advantage to seeing the film first is that you can really see it on its own terms, and contrary to some reviews I've seen, I did not find it confusing in the least despite knowing just about nothing of the source material at the time. The film got the meaning across nicely without feeling like it was cramming a long book into a film too short for the material, as tends to happen with faithful adaptations.

I also disagree with a Watchmen fan I talked to after the movie, who said the message felt jammed down our throats; I didn't find it particularly much more so than in the comic itself.

Now, the most major change is naturally the squid. I must say that although the squid is fun, the film's ending is superior from a storytelling perspective, if only because it makes Ozymandias' plot far more elegant and less needlessly complicated - in the book it seems really uncharacteristic of him to choose specifically to create a horror like the squid over all other possible options, although that could just be my movie-first self speaking - perhaps that was precisely the point in the original. It also ties things together more neatly and gives Dr. Manhattan back some of the importance he didn't really warrant in the original. The essence of the ending remains the same, however, so I think it's relatively unimportant in the long run.


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## opaltiger (Mar 10, 2009)

Taliax said:


> I won't see it because it has nudity and it's rated R.


It's okay, the nudity is _blue._


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## Butterfree (Mar 10, 2009)

Not exclusively. You also have the overly long sex scene in the middle (or at least I think you saw breasts in it? I'm not sure). Zack Snyder really has a thing for random overly long sex scenes, doesn't he? It was one of those things that bugged me about the movie; I can only watch characters having sex on screen for so long before I start really wanting to give them some privacy.

(The other main things that bugged me were 



Spoiler



the random inclusion of Bubastis, which sadly turned out not to be that much less random in the comic, and the fact that the psychologist did not make _any_ comment on the irony of subjecting Rorschach to the Rorschach test. :( And the fact that Rorschach could look at any of those ink blots and think anything but 'GIVE ME MY FACE BACK'. In the comic the ink blots at least didn't look quite like the patterns on Rorschach's mask.


)


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## Yarnchu (Mar 10, 2009)

I want to see this, mainly because it looks interesting. My brother has the graphic novel, so he is going to let me read it after he is done. But I want to see the film so badly.


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## goldenquagsire (Mar 10, 2009)

> I won't see it because it has nudity


So it's safe to assume that you don't have any mirrors in your bathroom. :P

The graphic novel is fucking rawk. Nowt else needs to be said, apart from READ THE DAMNED THING, CRETINS. Eagerly anticipating the movie, mostly because loads of people have said that it's actually not a horrid adaptation. Also not giving much of a shit about the whole "MAKING A MOVIE OUT OF WATCHMEN IS TANTAMOUNT TO BLASPHEMY" spiel.


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## Fredie (Mar 10, 2009)

The film looks so damn good, I really wanted to see it. Until I found out it was an 18. Which means I'll probably just wait until it comes out on DVD or something...


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## Dannichu (Mar 11, 2009)

I haven't seen it, but I've read that there's a rape scene in there that could have been shown a bit more tastefully. Is that true?


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## Rwr4539 (Mar 11, 2009)

A friend of mine watched it and thought it was a disappointment. :/
Might read the graphic novel though if I get the chance.


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## Lady Grimdour (Mar 13, 2009)

Dannichu said:


> I haven't seen it, but I've read that there's a rape scene in there that could have been shown a bit more tastefully. Is that true?


True, but then Snyder has a thing for sex scenes. 300 anyone?


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## Butterfree (Mar 14, 2009)

The actual rape (only attempted, technically) was really not portrayed as erotic in the least, though. :/ And though it's very violent, it's no more so than the rest of the movie. What bothers me about the rape is more the fact that she sort of fell in love with him and had consensual sex with him later anyway.


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## goldenquagsire (Mar 15, 2009)

Butterfree said:


> The actual rape (only attempted, technically) was really not portrayed as erotic in the least, though. :/ And though it's very violent, it's no more so than the rest of the movie. What bothers me about the rape is more the fact that she sort of fell in love with him and had consensual sex with him later anyway.


Well, at least it's true to the book.


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## nastypass (Mar 15, 2009)

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/485797

THIS SHOULD BE RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD'S INTERESTS


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## Butterfree (Mar 16, 2009)

> Well, at least it's true to the book.


In the movie I'm pretty sure they were trying to make it slightly more acceptable, actually, with the line "I could never hate him. He gave me you." The book seemed to have her more blatantly in love with him after all of it, while that line implies she is more just reluctant to despise him because of her love for Laurie, leaving her latent feelings for him behind.



> http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/485797
> 
> THIS SHOULD BE RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD'S INTERESTS


Hee, I saw that a while ago. I absolutely _love_ pie-juggling Rorschach. And the unmistakably Hanna-Barbera Bubastis.

In other news, an Icelandic film critic wrote a downright bizarre review of Watchmen today, where he managed to completely forget the existence of Rorschach even while listing all the other main characters, described the conflict as the "good superheroes" fighting the "bad superheroes" (perhaps that's why he couldn't fit Rorschach in), and casually mentioned in the middle of it that oh, by the way, Ozymandias is the villain. What the hell.


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## nastypass (Mar 17, 2009)

Butterfree said:


> Ozymandias is the villain.


dammit me stop accidentally highlighting these things


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## Butterfree (Mar 18, 2009)

D: Nuuu! Sorry.

To ramble on a bit more! I saw the movie again today. Post-comic impressions of it include:



Spoiler: Watchmen comic and film



- I miss the scene at the end where Ozymandias is meditating and talks to Jon. They crammed the dialogue from it into the preceding and succeeding scenes, sure, but I really liked how it came out in that scene; Ozymandias seemed more genuinely sad about what he had done and more confounded by Jon. In the movie, it doesn't get across as well, since the scene is generally busier.
- I also miss Ozymandias' "I did it!" He seems a lot more insane on a second viewing and I think it would make him more human again to keep that line.
- I love what the movie did to Daniel at the end, though. In the comic, his initial reaction to what Ozymandias did was "That's terrible! How can a human being make a decision like that? ...well, okay, fine. I won't talk." And then he just went on to have sex with Laurie by Adrian's pool while Rorschach got himself splatterified. The movie made him _care_, and if his "NOOOO" was a bit overboard, overall I think it was a good decision to have him witness Rorschach's death (so he could get to at least react to it, after all the time the story has spent developing their relationship), and letting him have his moment of standing up to Adrian made him a much better character in my opinion.
- Rorschach seems so much more disturbingly attractive under the mask the second time around, when it's not as much of a shock to see him unmasked.
- They really should have given a little bit of information about what the hell Bubastis is. Admittedly it doesn't make sense in the movie's plot that Ozymandias would be doing any genetics research, but she really needs some sort of an explanation. I know why she's in there to begin with - showing that Ozymandias is not only willing to sacrifice the lives of strangers and the other masked heroes but also that of somebody he holds very dear to himself personally - but the first time around I had a hard time even figuring out that Bubastis was her name.
- Jon got his point about miracles across so much better in the comic. ;_;
- I loved the little cameo at the end by the newspaper stand guy and the guy who was reading Tales of the Black Freighter. <3


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## koolkitty (Mar 18, 2009)

Watchmen was the best movie I saw this year, by far. The way it the plot threads all intertwined and then came together by the end of the movie was amazing.


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## opaltiger (Mar 23, 2009)

opaltiger said:


> Read three chapters so far. I am somehow not as impressed as all the hype has made me feel I should be.


never mind



Spoiler



_the villain pulls it off omv_





> I haven't seen it, but I've read that there's a rape scene in there that could have been shown a bit more tastefully. Is that true?


Rape scenes should not be tasteful.


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## Teh Ebil Snorlax (Mar 23, 2009)

I saw it and loved it, I think a bit more superheroing would have been nicer and maybe not everyone should have killed someone. And the soundtrack was pretty awesome too.


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## Cloaked (Mar 24, 2009)

I intend to see it.  I have no previous expectations, since I have diligently avoided looking at the spoilers for it, and have deliberately forgotten the spoilers I saw*.  Needless to say, as long as it's better than Transformers, or most of the early scenes in 300, it should be okay.  I'm not expecting another V.


*There's a trick to it.  Explaining the mechanics behind it is rather like describing what toffee tastes like.


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## ESP (Mar 24, 2009)

Teh Ebil Snorlax said:


> And the soundtrack was pretty awesome too.


The soundtrack was kinda random in a lot of places.

Anyways, I loved the movie. Rorschach and the Comedian were great, which kind of balanced out Silk Spectre's terrible acting.

Also I lol'ed when the Comedian yelled for a medic after being hit with that bottle. Too much TF2.


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## opaltiger (Mar 24, 2009)

> The soundtrack was kinda random in a lot of places.


haha when 99 Luftballons came on I was like "what".

but yeah, Dylan, Hendrix, Simon and Garfunkel? <3 eta: OH and Janis Joplin


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## Werty (Mar 26, 2009)

I saw this film in Imax a few days after it came out; I left the theater utterly amazed. This movie, I felt, was splendidly pulled off. I had no prior dealings with any Watchmen media before. I felt that Zac was brilliant in his use of music, montage, motifs, and his interpretations and portrayal of the themes. Every character I felt attached to, but my favorites with Jon and Ozy. It promoted so much thinking in my mind, about the heavily contrasting philosophies of all the main characters and their place in the world they live in. What I felt were particularly strong was the opening with The Times They Are A-Changin' playing, Jon's segment, and the climax. Also, excellent first scene.

When I left, I went to the bookstore and read the comic immediately. It was a lovely indulgence; I laughed when the Owl Ship sex scene is given one panel in the comic when it's exaggerated so much in the movie.

Then I saw the movie again. This time, I caught so many small details that I would have never seen prior, and this showing was only in a normal theater. It's great to see something very small in the background and know instantly what it is.

Watchmen is an extremely cathartic experience.

Regardless, nearly everything Butterfree said regarding the adaption from the comic to the movie. The different interpretations of the ending, the characterization. No need in repetition.


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